Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:39 am, Post These a11y cookies normally expire after about seven days, but are removed immediately if you restore the applicable settings to their default values. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. This website is using a security service to protect itself from online attacks. Thanks for copying the information from my other post here. When that connection is fully engaged, the fluid clutchs torus members are effectively locked together they must turn together at engine speed and transmit no torque. To avoid stalling or lugging the engine, the clutch would automatically disengage if road speed fell below 13 mph (21 km/h). However, that did not cure the shuddering problem. Because of the lack of traction and limited tires, it's not critical that a street engine launch at peak-torque rpm. All rights reserved. The effective dates of the current versions are: Paid advertisements and/or sponsored links on Ate Up With Motor will be identified with words such as "Sponsor," "Sponsors," "Sponsored Link(s)," "Sponsored Content," "Ad," "Advertisement," "Advertisement(s)," or "Paid Promotion" (and/or by images or icons containing such words). Not all the listed cookies and/or data items are necessarily set in all instances, and there may sometimes be others not listed above, particularly if you are logged into a Google account. The turbine and lockup clutch driven plate are both splined to the transmission input shaft (medium blue). Most street torque. Required fields are marked *. Petrol / Gas. The DG series transmissions were notionally three-speed automatics (although early iterations were designed to start in second gear) with a torque converter lockup clutch. Adding stall speed to the torque converter increases the power available to accelerate the car more quickly. One of the fundamental differences between a fluid clutch (a fluid coupling or torque converter) and a mechanical plate clutch is slippage. Big cars weighing over 3,300 pounds generally need a converter with more torque multiplication. With automated hydraulic operation and combinations of brakes and clutches, it was possible to get the same results more efficiently. A manufacturer's torque-converter rating is generally expressed as an rpm range. This is due in part to the technological advances in torque converters. If your going over ten your gonna need a new torque converter fairly soon..depends how you drive.. my converter started off slipping at about 13 on the 275 and ended up wearing out pretty quick and it began slipping like 45-50 on the gauge. Once the brakes (or the transbrake) is released and the vehicle begins to move, the turbine spins up and the speed difference between the two diminishes. You must be at least 18 to comment. The drive fan moves air across the blades of the driven fan (which is turned off). These cookies are necessary for the site's administrative users (who wouldn't even be able to log in without them), but if you are not an administrative user, these cookies aren't normally placed on your device at all unless you somehow access the login area, which is off-limits to non-administrators. Think of it this way, a well built converter, 10" may slip 4-5%, if yours slips 6-7% higher, you are baking the fluid, cooking the band, and compromising the clutches, and giving up mph and ET. Privacy Statement - Giving Slip the Slip: Lockup Torque Converters and Split Torque California residents also have the Right to Opt-Out of the sale of their personal information see the Do Not Sell My Personal Information page. I purchased my car 3 weeks ago from a new car dealership.. 1. and 2. With Torque Pro torque slip shows it at 0-6 rpm at 60 mph and when coming to a stop it jumps to 25-40 rpm then raises to 1400+. For one, the engine would stall every time the vehicle came to a halt with the lockup clutch engaged unless the driver shifted to neutral each time. 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The image file itself contains no personally identifiable information, but the loading of that file may be used to help identify and/or track you. Cookie Notice Input output shaft readings are almost exactly the same when driving. Tuning. When coasting, the turbine overruns the impeller, which causes slippage, but relatively little braking effect. It took the addition of a small device called the stator to increase the efficiency of the fluid coupling and transform it into a torque converter. The space ahead of the clutch formed a hydraulic cylinder containing an annular steel piston that acted as a pressure plate. Performance & security by Cloudflare. This is most noticeable from about 1200-1800 rpm. iThemes is one of the Liquid Web family of brands; iThemes and Liquid Web are trademarks of Liquid Web, LLC.). The DG series transmissions obtained their indirect ratios with a compound planetary gearset. Hydraulic slippage is much less desirable at cruising speed. Once engaged, the lockup clutch simply drove the output shaft at engine speed (not turbine speed). In Drive, the direct clutch is engaged and both bands are released, causing the input sun gear, the low sun gear (orange), the planet carrier and output shaft (light green) to turn at input shaft speed. sir im having an issue with my 93 f150 aod. Locking the converter with a scan tool bypasses the tune and verifies everything mechanical is in order. Privacy Policy. The multiplication factor is based on the speed difference between the turbine and impeller. For people who want a broader overview, I would recommend a book by Philip G. Gott entitled Changing Gears: The Development of the Automotive Transmission, published by the SAE as part of their Historical Series in 1991. The wp-donottrack_feed cookie, which controls a blog feed, was set by accessing the dashboard menu for the WP DoNotTrack plugin (which we do not currently use on this website); this cookie normally expires in about one year. Members can start their own topics & subscribe to topics There was also a kickdown mechanism that allowed the driver to disengage the clutch at road speeds between 13 and 56 mph (21 and 90 km/h) by flooring the accelerator, allowing the torque converter to again multiply torque. Torque Converter Engaged while pulling??? another masterpiece. The action you just performed triggered the security solution. Filling the cylinder with pressurized oil would lock the pressure plate to the clutch plate itself, forcing the clutch and input shaft to rotate with the torus cover at engine speed. The wahFontColor and wahBgColor cookies, which are set if you alter the site's color scheme, normally expire after about 14 days, but you can remove them immediately by clicking the "Restore Defaults" button on the sidebar. This viscous connection is transmission fluid. if you dont hammer on it everyday it will last you a long time.. my stock converter had 350 rpms of slip on the 310 tune and the truck still had all kinds of power even locked. The stock converter wouldn't with a big tune unless I was cruising at light throttle. We thought 10 was bad 2 years ago. The only problem - there's a boat-load of information and I only know how to interpret a fraction of it. Akamai is a registered trademark or service mark of Akamai Technologies, Inc. in the United States (Reg. They normally expire in just under one year, but you can delete the cookies in your browser (or other user agent) at any time. The result will be every car will have efficient, smooth, and comfortable rides. Theshuddering makes the car lagand is very noticeable. Vehicle weight is another major factor that should be considered when selecting a converter. A healthy plate clutch slips only briefly when engaged or disengaged. check trans fluid. But Ive never heard of anyone going that route. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. These torque converters allow some slippage but it should not vary much from the desired PCM value. Wallace Racing BACK to Auto Math. The torque converter is made up of five parts: 1. I was monitoring some Torque converter params for my 4R55E with my in dash scantool. When you submit a comment, you may have the option save your information for future comments, storing the info in these cookies. The one for torque slip desired is 1020 rpm. Borg-Warner continued to sell the DG series for several more years to some non-U.S. customers, but U.S. automakers would not rediscover the lockup clutch for another 20 years. The vehicle suffered a torque converter failure at around 140k miles. Have you ever gotten in your car, started it up, put it in gear only to feel it shudder? There are several actions that could trigger this block including submitting a certain word or phrase, a SQL command or malformed data. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. I never saw a problem with the converter, it never went over 3 to 4 RPM slippage at WOT with it locked. Ate Up With Motor, its logo, and other associated icons and graphics are trademarks and/or service marks of Aaron Severson dba Ate Up With Motor. A reverse band surrounds a brake drum connected to the front carrier, which is also integral with the rear annulus (orange). Overdrive ratios drive the torque converter at speeds generally below normal coupling speed, creating increased slippage and heat, which is unacceptable. Your IP: The faster it spins, the more force it provides, which causes the fluid to flow faster and harder. Stator The stator is called the middleman. For more information about how Akamai may collect, process, and/or use personal data, visit the Akamai "Privacy and Policies" page and Privacy Trust Center. Actual shows 640 rpm in drive with the brake on. We may sometimes present an alternative version of the sidebar offering different options, which may set the a11y-desaturated, a11y-high-contrast, and/or a11y-larger-fontsize cookies if you change those settings. Cloudflare Ray ID: 7c0ed4b42f522a79 The torque converter, with its multiple elements, is being manufactured with an eye towards the future. Only lasts from .5 seconds to 2 seconds. Forum. Over 10 RPM is real slip. Even though Dyno numbers are just a number, For reference my 2018 Gen3 made 400rwhp/390rwtq stock with 5k miles on a Dynojet,, It hit the speed limiter at 6700. (For each of these cookies, "xx" will be a cryptographic hash.) A converter that might have a stall speed of 5,000 rpm for a pure drag car would be completely miserable on the street. Its weird its not noticable as even a new soft engaging lock up but it acts somewhat like it has one. You can hide the "Support Ate Up With Motor" box and prevent the loading of its embedded content by going to the "Consent Management" tab and switching the "Allow PayPal Button" toggle to "OFF." Hence, you've commanded your torque converter every time your car shifted gears. A high-stall converter like a 4,000-rpm unit is not only lazy from a part-throttle-efficiency standpoint, but it also generates much more heat. Diagnosing a potential Torque Converter problem with a Scan tool. Multiple different problems, some transmission related, some engine related, all resulting in driveability issues. If oil pressure to the cylinder was relieved, the pressure plate would no longer be held against the clutch plate, disengaging the clutch and allowing the torque converter to function normally. When the torque converter starts malfunctioning, you may feel shuddering and even slipping in overdrive. One of the fundamental differences between a fluid clutch (a fluid coupling or torque converter) and a mechanical plate clutch is slippage. All site content Copyright 2007-var year=new Date(); year=year.getYear(); if (year<1900) year+=1900; document.write(year); FordFlex.net FordFlex.net is in no way affiliated with Ford Motor Company. . There is more demand in today's market for increased comfort and safety in cars. There is going to be some slip. Your email address will not be published. Reaction torque locked the rear sun gear against the rear one-way clutch, driving the planet carrier and output shaft forward at 69.7% (1 / 1.44) of turbine speed. This overran the rear unit planet carrier, unlocking the rear sun gears one-way clutch and putting the transmission in direct drive. I re-used the "new" valve body and decided to try out my original solenoid pack to avoid having to reprogram the PCM with the new calibration for the solenoid pack that came with the recycled transmission. It is the lack of fluid that causes overheating, slipping, or shuddering. A flyweight 2,800-pound car like an early Mustang or Chevy II could use less multiplication to successfully launch on their relatively smaller rear tires. Accessing certain posts or pages on this website may require you to enter a specific password. If you correctly enter the password, the site saves this cookie on your device to allow you access to the password-protected post or page. Logging in sets the wordpress_logged_in_xx, wordpress_sec_xx, and/or wordpress_xx cookies, which store the user's login credentials to allow access to the administrative dashboard and other administrative functions; there may be multiple iterations of each cookie. Okay, so it sounds like you were able to identify a potential root cause. For all the administrative and login cookies described here, "xx" will be a cryptographic hash while "UID" will be the administrative user's user ID number in this website's WordPress database. With no slip at all. if someone would have put in a used ecu ,fron a electric controlled aod. You only monitor it when the converter is locked. I was running the KEM 250 and 310 tunes. So far the bogging down hasn't happened since last week. Your Transmission Fluid is Contaminated. Please include what you were doing when this page came up and the Cloudflare Ray ID found at the bottom of this page. My SunCoast converter has a little slip. Your car's automatic transmission has a torque converter. Google, Google Analytics, and other related marks and logos are trademarks of Google LLC.). Your IP: This will cause damage to both the transmission and the converter. there were around 6 defaults that popped up. You've now repaired or replaced your torque converter if it exhibited any of the above common torque converter problems. For a drag-race car, the cost of this additional slippage is worth the price, but for a street car it creates other problems. Some electrical tape and some plastic wire loom may solve your issue entirely. There will typically be several such cookies, each beginning with "gdpr" (e.g., gdpr[allowed_cookies], gdpr&5Bprivacy_bar&5D, and gdpr[consent_types]). Your torque converter is full of fluid, and its jobis to act as a hydraulic pump and acts as a coupling between the engine and the transmission. A Simpson gearset (which Ill be discussing in great detail in the next few days) provides the same number of ratios from only two gearsets, and a single Ravigneaux gearset can give you four forward speeds and reverse if you have enough clutches. (These cookies are not usually set for administrative users, since comments they submit while logged in are associated with their user ID number and user profile information rather than a manually entered name and email address.). Estimate Converter Slip. The end result is the torque converterisn't able to transferthat power completely and efficiently from the engine to the transmission. Torque converter seals can get damaged for several reasons. With the clutch engaged, Ultramatic also transmitted some drivetrain vibration that the torque converter would otherwise have absorbed. A lot of bad things can happen to your car when the torque converter starts failing. by SirHandyMan Sun Apr 07, 2019 9:43 am, Post This is why a disc clutch must be disengaged or the transmission shifted to neutral whenever the vehicle stops. However, Wilson gearboxes were quite bulky and complex because the nature of their operation required a separate set of epicyclic gears for each ratio, including reverse. JavaScript is disabled. would it work,yet throw out aod default codes.
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